Godfather of AI: They Keep Silencing Me But I’m Trying to Warn Them!

章节 1：AI教父的起源与神经网络的崛起

📝 本节摘要：

本章作为访谈的开篇，包含了节目开场的精彩高光混剪与主持人的频道订阅呼吁。随后访谈正式切入正题，探讨了杰弗里·辛顿（Geoffrey Hinton）被称为“AI教父”的缘由。辛顿回顾了自20世纪50年代以来人工智能领域的两条路线之争：基于逻辑和符号运算的传统方法，以及模拟人类大脑运作的人工神经网络（Artificial Neural Networks）路径。他讲述了自己如何在少数人支持的情况下，坚持研究神经网络长达50年，并因此吸引了一批顶尖学生（包括后来参与创建OpenAI的核心成员）。他同时提到，如果计算机先驱冯·诺依曼和图灵没有早逝，神经网络技术原本会更早被科学界所接受。

[原文] [Host]: they call you the godfather of ai so what would you be saying to people about their career prospects in a world of super intelligence

[译文] [主持人]: 他们称你为AI教父，那么在一个超级智能（super intelligence）的世界里，你对人们的职业前景有什么想说的？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: train to be a plumber

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 去培训当个水管工吧。

[原文] [Host]: really yeah okay i'm going to become a plumber jeffrey hinton is the nobel prize winning pioneer whose groundbreaking work has shaped ai and the future of humanity why do they call it the godfather of ai

[译文] [主持人]: 真的吗？好吧，那我要去当水管工了。杰弗里·辛顿（Geoffrey Hinton）是荣获诺贝尔奖的先驱，他开创性的工作塑造了人工智能（AI）和人类的未来。为什么他们称他为AI教父呢？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: because there weren't many people who believed that we could model ai on the brain so that it learned to do complicated things like recognize objects and images or even do reasoning and i pushed that approach for 50 years and then google acquired that technology and i worked there for 10 years on something that's now used all the time in ai

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 因为当时没有多少人相信我们可以基于大脑来构建AI模型，从而让它学会做一些复杂的事情，比如识别物体和图像，甚至进行推理。我推动这种方法长达50年，后来谷歌（Google）收购了这项技术，我在那里工作了10年，研究的东西现在在AI中被频繁使用。

[原文] [Host]: and then you left why

[译文] [主持人]: 然后你离开了，为什么？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: so that i could talk freely at a conference

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 为了我能在一次会议上自由地发言。

[原文] [Host]: what did you want to talk about freely

[译文] [主持人]: 你想自由地谈论什么？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: how dangerous ai could be i realized that these things will one day get smarter than us and we've never had to deal with that and if you want to know what life's like when you're not the apex intelligence ask a chicken

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: AI可能会有多危险。我意识到这些东西总有一天会比我们更聪明，而我们从未应对过这种情况。如果你想知道当你不再是顶级智能（apex intelligence）时生活是什么样的，去问问小鸡就知道了。

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: so there's risks that come from people misusing ai and then there's risks from ai getting super smart and deciding it doesn't need us

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 所以，存在着人们滥用AI带来的风险，然后还存在着AI变得超级聪明并决定它不再需要我们所带来的风险。

[原文] [Host]: is that a real risk

[译文] [主持人]: 这是一个真实的风险吗？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: yes it is but they're not going to stop it cuz it's too good for too many things

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 是的，但他们不会阻止它，因为它在太多事情上太好用了。

[原文] [Host]: what about regulations

[译文] [主持人]: 那监管（regulations）呢？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: they have some but they're not designed to deal with most of the threats like the european regulations have a clause that say none of these apply to military uses of ai

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 他们有一些，但它们不是用来应对大多数威胁的。比如欧洲的法规里有一个条款写着，这些规定都不适用于AI的军事用途。

[原文] [Host]: really

[译文] [主持人]: 真的吗？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: yeah it's crazy

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 是的，这很疯狂。

[原文] [Host]: one of your students left openai

[译文] [主持人]: 你的一个学生离开了OpenAI。

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: yeah he was probably the most important person behind the development of the early versions of church gpt and i think he left because he had safety concerns we should recognize that this stuff is an existential threat and we have to face the possibility that unless we do something soon we're near the end so let's do the risks what do we end up doing in such a world

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 是的，他可能是早期版本Chat GPT（注：原文音频识别错写为church gpt）开发背后最重要的人物，我认为他离开是因为他有安全方面的担忧。我们应该认识到这东西是一个生存威胁（existential threat），我们必须面对这样一种可能性：除非我们尽快采取行动，否则我们可能离终点不远了。所以让我们来谈谈这些风险，在这样一个世界里我们最终该怎么办？

[原文] [Host]: this has always blown my mind a little bit 53% of you that listen to the show regularly haven't yet subscribed to the show so could i ask you for a favor before we start if you like the show and you like what we do here and you want to support us the free simple way that you can do just that is by hitting the subscribe button and my commitment to you is if you do that then i'll do everything in my power me and my team to make sure that this show is better for you every single week we'll listen to your feedback we'll find the guests that you want me to speak to and we'll continue to do what we do thank you so much

[译文] [主持人]: 这总是让我感到有些震惊，经常听我们节目的观众中有53%还没有订阅本频道。所以在我们开始之前，我能请大家帮个忙吗？如果你喜欢这个节目，喜欢我们在这里做的事情，并且想支持我们，最免费、最简单的方法就是点击订阅按钮。我对你们的承诺是，如果你们这样做了，那么我以及我的团队将尽一切努力，确保这个节目每周都能为你变得更好。我们会倾听你的反馈，我们会找到你想让我对话的嘉宾，我们会继续做我们正在做的事情。非常感谢你们。

[原文] [Host]: jeffrey hinsson they call you the godfather of ai uh

[译文] [主持人]: 杰弗里·辛顿（注：原文音频识别错写为jeffrey hinsson），他们叫你AI教父，呃。

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: yes they do

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 是的，他们这么叫。

[原文] [Host]: why do they call you that

[译文] [主持人]: 他们为什么这样称呼你？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: there weren't that many people who believed that we could make neural networks work artificial neural networks so for a long time in ai from the 1950s onwards there were kind of two ideas about how to do ai

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 当时并没有那么多人相信我们能让人工神经网络（artificial neural networks）发挥作用。所以在很长一段时间里，从20世纪50年代以后的人工智能领域，关于如何做AI大概有两种观点。

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: one idea was that sort of core of human intelligence was reasoning and to do reasoning you needed to use some form of logic and so ai had to be based around logic and in your head you must have something like symbolic expressions that you manipulated with rules and that's how intelligence worked and things like learning or reasoning by analogy that all come later once we've figured out how basic reasoning works

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 第一种观点认为，人类智能的核心是推理（reasoning），而要进行推理，你需要使用某种形式的逻辑（logic），所以AI必须基于逻辑。在你的大脑里，一定有类似符号表达式（symbolic expressions）的东西，你可以用规则来操作它们，这就是智能运作的方式。至于学习（learning）或者类比推理（reasoning by analogy）这类事情，都是在我们弄清楚基本推理如何运作之后才会出现的后话。

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: there was a different approach which is to say let's model ai on the brain because obviously the brain makes us intelligent so simulate a network of brain cells on a computer and try and figure out how you would learn strengths of connections between brain cells so that it learned to do complicated things like recognize objects in images or recognize speech or even do reasoning

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 还有一种不同的路径，那就是说，让我们基于大脑来构建AI模型，因为显然是大脑让我们变得智能。所以，在计算机上模拟一个脑细胞网络，并试着弄清楚你该如何学习脑细胞之间连接的强度（strengths of connections），从而让它学会做一些复杂的事情，比如识别图像中的物体，或者识别语音，甚至进行推理。

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: i pushed that approach for like 50 years because so few people believed in it there weren't many good universities that had groups that did that so if you did that the best young students who believed in that came and worked with you

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 我推动这种方法大概有50年，因为相信它的人太少了。当时并没有多少优秀的大学有专门做这个的团队，所以如果你做了这个方向，那些相信这一理念的最优秀的年轻学生就会跑来和你一起工作。

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: so i was very fortunate in getting a whole lot of really good students some of which have gone on to create and play an instrumental role in creating platforms like open ai

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 所以我非常幸运地招收到了一大批非常优秀的学生，其中一些人后来去创立了，并在创建像OpenAI这样的平台中发挥了核心作用。

[原文] [Host]: yes so i sus a nice example a whole bunch of them why did you believe that modeling it off the brain was a more effective approach

[译文] [主持人]: 是的，所以我猜（注：原文音频sus疑似识别错误）这是一个很好的例子，他们中的一大批人。你为什么认为以大脑为原型建模是一种更有效的方法？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: it wasn't just me believed it early on fonoyman believed it and cheuring believed it and if either of those had lived i think ai would have had a very different history but they both died young

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 早期并不只是我这么认为，冯·诺依曼（von Neumann，注：原文音频识别错写为fonoyman）相信它，图灵（Turing，注：原文音频识别错写为cheuring）也相信它。如果他们中的任何一个人还活着，我认为AI将会有一段非常不同的历史，但他们都英年早逝了。

[原文] [Host]: you think ai would have been here sooner

[译文] [主持人]: 你认为AI会更早到来吗？

[原文] [Geoffrey Hinton]: i think neural net the neural net approach would have been accepted much sooner if either of them had lived

[译文] [杰弗里·辛顿]: 我认为，如果他们中的任何一个还活着，神经网络（neural net），即神经网络这种方法，会早得多被科学界接受。